|
|
 | | From: | Nick Glynn | | Subject: | M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000 |
|
|
 | I have used the M2 client for a long time now and was overjoyed when RSS
feeds were introduced. However, things aren't that great. After continued
use for about two weeks now, m2 is now incorrectly reporting I have new
newsfeeds when i have none, it shows my wired news feed in the active
contacts view, it shows some emails in my addict3d.org newsfeeds which is
rather unnerving and now Trash is in bold and showing i have 2 unread
messages but there are none in there. Any advice or is there a 3rd party
program to clean up the M2 index? I looked through a number of the files
but no joy.
Cheers
Nick
--
Sent using M2, Operas mail program that requires an overhaul
|
|
| | From: | Trevor Gough | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:50:04 -0600 |
|
|
| On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000, Nick Glynn
wrote:
> I have used the M2 client for a long time now and was overjoyed when RSS
> feeds were introduced. However, things aren't that great. After
> continued use for about two weeks now, m2 is now incorrectly reporting I
> have new newsfeeds when i have none, it shows my wired news feed in the
> active contacts view, it shows some emails in my addict3d.org newsfeeds
> which is rather unnerving and now Trash is in bold and showing i have 2
> unread messages but there are none in there. Any advice or is there a
> 3rd party program to clean up the M2 index? I looked through a number of
> the files but no joy.
>
> Cheers
> Nick
>
Opera 8 Beta 1 is the worst release of Opera in final or beta or preview
form I've seen for this sort of thing. I have tried 2 different clean
installations of Opera 8 Beta 1 with the same results you are seeing:
newsfeed messages scattered about crazily. It is barely usable in this
version of Opera.
Opera really needs to address the indexing of messages.
The newsfeed messages are getting mixed up with mail messages. Trying to
clean up the mess is nearly impossible (actually, impossible, from my
standpoint) without losing mail messages in the process.
I am concluding that Opera's use of beta/preview versions is really only
suitable for people who don't rely on the mail/newsgroup/newsfeed portion
of the client. If you rely on those functions, I think Opera is far too
buggy in these interim releases to be counted upon.
|
|
| | From: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 21:57:46 +0100 |
|
|
| On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:50:04 -0600, Trevor Gough wrote:
...
Opera 8 Beta 1 is the worst release of Opera in final or beta or preview
> form I've seen for this sort of thing. I have tried 2 different clean
> installations of Opera 8 Beta 1 with the same results you are seeing:
> newsfeed messages scattered about crazily. It is barely usable in this
> version of Opera.
>
> Opera really needs to address the indexing of messages.
I'm not denying your experiences, but they don't seem to be general. How
old is your M2 message base? If you are not keeping extensive filters, and
don't mind removing newsgroup and newsfeed articles, you could try to
clean up things thoroughly.
For example:
- make a backup of /mail
- start Opera
- delete all newsfeed and newsgroup messages, empty trash. maybe restart
Opera once.
- close Opera
- delete /mail/lexicon and /mail/index.ini
- start Opera, wait for reindexing to finish
- go to Received, maybe Opera will now start removing items it can't find
anymore from the message list
- Feeds > Manage Newfeeds > resubscribing to newsfeeds (IIRC they will be
gone from the mail panel because of removing index.ini)
- Mail > Newsgroups... > resubscribe to your newsgroups (ditto)
--
The Web is a procrastination apparatus: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek
It can absorb as much time as | Documentation & QA
is required to ensure that you | Opera Software ASA
won't get any real work done. - J.Nielsen
|http://my.opera.com/Rijk/journal
|
|
| | From: | Trevor and Michelle Gough | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 15:49:54 -0600 |
|
|
|
"Rijk van Geijtenbeek" wrote in message
news:opsktgike1cvfty8@news.opera.com...
> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:50:04 -0600, Trevor Gough wrote:
>
> ..
>
> Opera 8 Beta 1 is the worst release of Opera in final or beta or preview
>> form I've seen for this sort of thing. I have tried 2 different clean
>> installations of Opera 8 Beta 1 with the same results you are seeing:
>> newsfeed messages scattered about crazily. It is barely usable in this
>> version of Opera.
>>
>> Opera really needs to address the indexing of messages.
>
> I'm not denying your experiences, but they don't seem to be general. How
> old is your M2 message base? If you are not keeping extensive filters, and
> don't mind removing newsgroup and newsfeed articles, you could try to
> clean up things thoroughly.
>
> For example:
> - make a backup of /mail
> - start Opera
> - delete all newsfeed and newsgroup messages, empty trash. maybe restart
> Opera once.
> - close Opera
> - delete /mail/lexicon and /mail/index.ini
> - start Opera, wait for reindexing to finish
> - go to Received, maybe Opera will now start removing items it can't find
> anymore from the message list
> - Feeds > Manage Newfeeds > resubscribing to newsfeeds (IIRC they will be
> gone from the mail panel because of removing index.ini)
> - Mail > Newsgroups... > resubscribe to your newsgroups (ditto)
>
> --
> The Web is a procrastination apparatus: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek
> It can absorb as much time as | Documentation & QA
> is required to ensure that you | Opera Software ASA
> won't get any real work done. - J.Nielsen
> |http://my.opera.com/Rijk/journal
>
I have done 2 clean installations of Opera 8 Beta 1 .... the same thing
happens each time. Messages appear in the wrong places. These messages are
not old at all. For instance, today I have brand new newsfeed messages
arriving and appearing in other newsfeed message subscription slots instead
of their own or in addition to their own. It is bizarre.
I don't have any confidence at this point your instructions would do any
good .... since a clean new installation causes the same thing. It is a
shame --- because I otherwise adore M2.
|
|
| | From: | Thomas H. | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:31:15 +0100 |
|
|
| Am Tue, 18 Jan 2005 21:57:46 +0100 hat Rijk van Geijtenbeek
geschrieben:
> For example:
> - make a backup of /mail
> - start Opera
> - delete all newsfeed and newsgroup messages, empty trash. maybe restart
> Opera once.
> - close Opera
> - delete /mail/lexicon and /mail/index.ini
> - start Opera, wait for reindexing to finish
> - go to Received, maybe Opera will now start removing items it can't
> find anymore from the message list
> - Feeds > Manage Newfeeds > resubscribing to newsfeeds (IIRC they will
> be gone from the mail panel because of removing index.ini)
> - Mail > Newsgroups... > resubscribe to your newsgroups (ditto)
>
Hi.
Id did this, and also cleaned my normal mail, as there was lots of useless
stuff in that. Interestingly, the size, of the mail folder didn't quite
match the size I would have expected. As Frode (?) said some time ago,
opera does some sort of cleanig up, after some time, so i duplicated the
installation (in fact I did this with the beta, and the last final),
worked with one version, an left the other in expectation of some sort of
magic-tidy up-shrinking of the mail folder ... nothing happened.
Sorry, but at this point, I got suspicious (if that is written that way ;)
).
I backed up everything, an deleted ALL my mail, emptied the trash, and
after deleting the lexicon-folder, wow, the mail folder was still 43 MB
big (before it was about 80).
And it didn't magically shrink afterwards ;).
So, I took the backup(s), exported all mails, deleted everything what has
to be deleted in the mail folder, imported the mail, let opera do its
re-indexing (in 8beta1 an 7.54u1), and both folders now are only some 30MB
big. Huh.
You see the realation: 80MB <-> 30 MB with same (viewable) mail in M2!
So, every since 7.0 came out, the people would ask for a proper
importing-dialog for O7 mail accounts, and ever since Opera told us, bla
bla bla, you don't need that, just copy the mail folder, bla bla bla.
So where the hell came the useless 50MBs from (I even deleted the old
lexicon and store folders, can't recall which version the new
folder-structure was introduced)
Tom
|
|
| | From: | Trevor and Michelle Gough | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 15:58:24 -0600 |
|
|
|
"Rijk van Geijtenbeek" wrote in message
news:opsktgike1cvfty8@news.opera.com...
> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:50:04 -0600, Trevor Gough wrote:
>
> ..
>
> Opera 8 Beta 1 is the worst release of Opera in final or beta or preview
>> form I've seen for this sort of thing. I have tried 2 different clean
>> installations of Opera 8 Beta 1 with the same results you are seeing:
>> newsfeed messages scattered about crazily. It is barely usable in this
>> version of Opera.
>>
>> Opera really needs to address the indexing of messages.
>
> I'm not denying your experiences, but they don't seem to be general.
There have been indexing issues presented both in the newsgroups and in the
Opera Forums for several months now. I do think there are some general
flaws that Opera needs to address certainly. Opera 8 Beta 1 is not the
first edition of Opera that has presented with similar problems --- it is
just the worst I have seen to date, though. It is a regressive trend, I
sadly admit.
|
|
| | From: | Leo H | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 20:15:01 -0600 |
|
|
| On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 15:58:24 -0600, Trevor and Michelle Gough
wrote:
>
> "Rijk van Geijtenbeek" wrote in message
> news:opsktgike1cvfty8@news.opera.com...
>> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:50:04 -0600, Trevor Gough wrote:
>>
>> ..
>>
>> Opera 8 Beta 1 is the worst release of Opera in final or beta or
>> preview
>>> form I've seen for this sort of thing. I have tried 2 different clean
>>> installations of Opera 8 Beta 1 with the same results you are seeing:
>>> newsfeed messages scattered about crazily. It is barely usable in this
>>> version of Opera.
>>>
>>> Opera really needs to address the indexing of messages.
>>
>> I'm not denying your experiences, but they don't seem to be general.
>
> There have been indexing issues presented both in the newsgroups and in
> the
> Opera Forums for several months now. I do think there are some general
> flaws that Opera needs to address certainly. Opera 8 Beta 1 is not the
> first edition of Opera that has presented with similar problems --- it is
> just the worst I have seen to date, though. It is a regressive trend, I
> sadly admit.
>
>
By an odd coincidence today I tried re-subscribing to opera.wishlist.
Things started off OK. Then I found a recent post describing lost or
misplaced mail experiences, which happened to be the post I am replying to
now. I checked "view read" to see older messages, and saw various mail
messages that had nothing to do with the group in the list. Starting to
panic, I tried un-subscribing and re subscribing to the group and things
got worse. I suspected that indexing had been corrupted. Copied the whole
mail directory into a a back up directory, and exited Opera. Then deleted
lexicon and restarted opera, which went into re-indexing, as expected.
When it was done, things were even more garbled than before, with about
600 messages showing unread in trash, where there had been only about 30
read ones there originally. The total message count is still about where
it should be (over 20,000), but only a few hundred are visible. Is there
any way of recovering the invisible ones, perhaps via export?
While searching for a clue to the problem I right clicked on the news
views to check properties The menu contained a line I did not remember,
"show messages from." For all except the new group (wishlist) only "news"
was checked. The new one had "mail" checked also, in case that matters.
I checked the "store" directory, and it contained a lot of mail. Many of
the "account" folders contained empty mbs files, which is not the case
with the current set.
I had an similar experience about a year ago after subscribing to a new
group, with the garbled message list, but I do not remember whether I lost
messages then. Other than that I have only had occasional single messages
vanish, but was never sure if it was an accidental delete or an Opera
issue.
Fortunately I made a backup copy of the mail directory on Jan 10, and am
working from it now.
--
Leo H
Version 8.00b1 Build 7401
P4 2.8 XP Pro Java 1.4.2 Sygate
|
|
| | From: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 10:14:10 +0100 |
|
|
| On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 20:15:01 -0600, Leo H wrote:
...
> While searching for a clue to the problem I right clicked on the news
> views to check properties The menu contained a line I did not remember,
> "show messages from." For all except the new group (wishlist) only
> "news" was checked. The new one had "mail" checked also, in case that
> matters.
I'm sorry, but this statement doesn't make sense. There can be only one
option checked in the 'Show messages from ...' submenu, and the choice is
global: it stays selected whatever view you select in the mail panel,
until you make another choice. That means, if you elect to only show
messages from 'News accounts', you mailing list access points will show no
messages. And if you select 'Mail accounts', the access points for your
news accounts will even be hidden. In both cases the Newsfeeds access
point will be hidden.
Don't confuse this account selector with the other dynamic 'filtering'
option: the local View button, with the menu 'Show > Show newsgroups',
'Show > Show mailing lists' etc. If you change the default choices, it
isn't very hard to make views show up empty.
The corruption that apparently still occurs sometimes is bad enough,
please try to not make matters more confusing by randomly changing
settings :)
--
The Web is a procrastination apparatus: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek
It can absorb as much time as | Documentation & QA
is required to ensure that you | Opera Software ASA
won't get any real work done. - J.Nielsen
|http://my.opera.com/Rijk/journal
|
|
| | From: | Leo H | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 10:48:42 -0600 |
|
|
| On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 10:14:10 +0100, Rijk van Geijtenbeek
wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 20:15:01 -0600, Leo H wrote:
>
> ..
>
>> While searching for a clue to the problem I right clicked on the news
>> views to check properties The menu contained a line I did not remember,
>> "show messages from." For all except the new group (wishlist) only
>> "news" was checked. The new one had "mail" checked also, in case that
>> matters.
>
> I'm sorry, but this statement doesn't make sense. There can be only one
> option checked in the 'Show messages from ...' submenu, and the choice
> is global: it stays selected whatever view you select in the mail panel,
> until you make another choice. That means, if you elect to only show
> messages from 'News accounts', you mailing list access points will show
> no messages. And if you select 'Mail accounts', the access points for
> your news accounts will even be hidden. In both cases the Newsfeeds
> access point will be hidden.
That is exactly what I would expect. I wish I had a screen shot of what I
am talking about, but clearly things were corrupted at the time.
>
> Don't confuse this account selector with the other dynamic 'filtering'
> option: the local View button, with the menu 'Show > Show newsgroups',
> 'Show > Show mailing lists' etc. If you change the default choices, it
> isn't very hard to make views show up empty.
This was not the local View button.
>
> The corruption that apparently still occurs sometimes is bad enough,
> please try to not make matters more confusing by randomly changing
> settings :)
>
My apologies for not being as methodical as I could have been. The main
point is that the mail system became corrupted before I tried to change
things, and I should have reported only that. I know I should expect
problems in a beta version and when they occur I try to report them.
--
Leo H
Version 8.00b1 Build 7401
P4 2.8 XP Pro Java 1.4.2 Sygate
|
|
| | From: | Y J Landro | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 21:22:17 +0100 |
|
|
| Nick Glynn skreiv Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000
> unread messages but there are none in there. Any advice or is there a
> 3rd party program to clean up the M2 index? I looked through a number of
> the files but no joy.
>
You may wish to try the tool on this page:
http://www.kmkorn.de/sw/opera/en/mbs2mbx.htm.
YMMV & HTH
Y J Landro
--
Bruker Opera sin revolusjonerande e-postklient: http://www.opera.com/m2/
|
|
| | From: | Nick Glynn | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:14:59 -0000 |
|
|
| Oh and as i was sending that previous message i also noticed that at the
bottom of the screen it said:
Sending Messages (0/234453256)
Well, that isnt right for a start! otherwise my ISP will kill me! :)
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000, Nick Glynn
wrote:
> I have used the M2 client for a long time now and was overjoyed when RSS
> feeds were introduced. However, things aren't that great. After
> continued use for about two weeks now, m2 is now incorrectly reporting I
> have new newsfeeds when i have none, it shows my wired news feed in the
> active contacts view, it shows some emails in my addict3d.org newsfeeds
> which is rather unnerving and now Trash is in bold and showing i have 2
> unread messages but there are none in there. Any advice or is there a
> 3rd party program to clean up the M2 index? I looked through a number of
> the files but no joy.
>
> Cheers
> Nick
>
--
Sent using M2, Operas mail program that requires an overhaul
|
|
| | From: | Alastair Scott | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 09:58:42 -0000 |
|
|
| On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000, Nick Glynn
wrote:
> I have used the M2 client for a long time now and was overjoyed when RSS
> feeds were introduced. However, things aren't that great. After
> continued use for about two weeks now, m2 is now incorrectly reporting I
> have new newsfeeds when i have none, it shows my wired news feed in the
> active contacts view, it shows some emails in my addict3d.org newsfeeds
> which is rather unnerving and now Trash is in bold and showing i have 2
> unread messages but there are none in there. Any advice or is there a
> 3rd party program to clean up the M2 index? I looked through a number of
> the files but no joy.
There is certainly something odd going on here.
I installed O8b1 from nothing (never installed on this machine before, no
import) then, after about 2 weeks of using M2 for mail, news and RSS, used
Klaus Meyer's mbs2mbx to export the sent mail to a mbox file. In that file
I noticed, interpolated with the sent email, a couple of emails which had
previously been _received_ by me and deleted from the user interface about
two weeks ago ... !
Alastair
|
|
| | From: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 12:06:11 +0100 |
|
|
| On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 09:58:42 -0000, Alastair Scott wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000, Nick Glynn
> wrote:
>
>> I have used the M2 client for a long time now and was overjoyed when
>> RSS feeds were introduced. However, things aren't that great. After
>> continued use for about two weeks now, m2 is now incorrectly reporting
>> I have new newsfeeds when i have none, it shows my wired news feed in
>> the active contacts view, it shows some emails in my addict3d.org
>> newsfeeds which is rather unnerving and now Trash is in bold and
>> showing i have 2 unread messages but there are none in there. Any
>> advice or is there a 3rd party program to clean up the M2 index? I
>> looked through a number of the files but no joy.
>
> There is certainly something odd going on here.
>
> I installed O8b1 from nothing (never installed on this machine before,
> no import) then, after about 2 weeks of using M2 for mail, news and RSS,
> used Klaus Meyer's mbs2mbx to export the sent mail to a mbox file. In
> that file I noticed, interpolated with the sent email, a couple of
> emails which had previously been _received_ by me and deleted from the
> user interface about two weeks ago ... !
Received and sent messages are stored in the same mbs files, one for each
month for each account. IIANM, Opera Mail doesn't actually remove the
content of deleted messages from the mbs storage files until it thinks it
is time to compress the mbs file.
--
The Web is a procrastination apparatus: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek
It can absorb as much time as | Documentation & QA
is required to ensure that you | Opera Software ASA
won't get any real work done. - J.Nielsen
|http://my.opera.com/Rijk/journal
|
|
| | From: | extrapolator | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 12:33:15 -0500 |
|
|
| On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 12:06:11 +0100, Rijk van Geijtenbeek
wrote:
> On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 09:58:42 -0000, Alastair Scott wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 13:13:34 -0000, Nick Glynn
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I have used the M2 client for a long time now and was overjoyed when
>>> RSS feeds were introduced. However, things aren't that great. After
>>> continued use for about two weeks now, m2 is now incorrectly reporting
>>> I have new newsfeeds when i have none, it shows my wired news feed in
>>> the active contacts view, it shows some emails in my addict3d.org
>>> newsfeeds which is rather unnerving and now Trash is in bold and
>>> showing i have 2 unread messages but there are none in there. Any
>>> advice or is there a 3rd party program to clean up the M2 index? I
>>> looked through a number of the files but no joy.
>>
>> There is certainly something odd going on here.
>>
>> I installed O8b1 from nothing (never installed on this machine before,
>> no import) then, after about 2 weeks of using M2 for mail, news and
>> RSS, used Klaus Meyer's mbs2mbx to export the sent mail to a mbox file.
>> In that file I noticed, interpolated with the sent email, a couple of
>> emails which had previously been _received_ by me and deleted from the
>> user interface about two weeks ago ... !
>
> Received and sent messages are stored in the same mbs files, one for
> each month for each account. IIANM, Opera Mail doesn't actually remove
> the content of deleted messages from the mbs storage files until it
> thinks it is time to compress the mbs file.
>
Let's have a manual command option to compact mailboxes (like Eudora has).
If Opera has some criteria and then it executes a routine to compact the
mailbox, it should be pretty easy to add a manual trigger to start that
routine.
--
http://www.xenodochy.org/ralph.html
Using the Opera Mail 8:00 build 7401 email client under W2K Prof
|
|
| | From: | Bob Williams | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 15:57:02 +0000 |
|
|
| In message , Trevor
Gough writes
>I am concluding that Opera's use of beta/preview versions is really
>only suitable for people who don't rely on the mail/newsgroup/newsfeed
>portion of the client. If you rely on those functions, I think Opera
>is far too buggy in these interim releases to be counted upon.
The whole point of beta-testing is to find the bugs before the final
product is released. If you want reliable mail/newsgroup/newsfeed then I
would humbly suggest that beta-testing is not for you.
--
Bob Zig-zag wanderer
|
|
| | From: | Trevor and Michelle Gough | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 18:15:12 -0600 |
|
|
|
"Bob Williams" wrote in message
news:Di3I3XHONo7BFwFP@main.machine...
> In message , Trevor
> Gough writes
>>I am concluding that Opera's use of beta/preview versions is really only
>>suitable for people who don't rely on the mail/newsgroup/newsfeed portion
>>of the client. If you rely on those functions, I think Opera is far too
>>buggy in these interim releases to be counted upon.
>
> The whole point of beta-testing is to find the bugs before the final
> product is released. If you want reliable mail/newsgroup/newsfeed then I
> would humbly suggest that beta-testing is not for you.
> --
> Bob Zig-zag wanderer
Yep, that is what I said. :-)
|
|
| | From: | Y J Landro | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Thu, 20 Jan 2005 01:22:00 +0100 |
|
|
| Bob Williams skreiv Wed, 19 Jan 2005 15:57:02 +0000
> In message , Trevor
> Gough writes
>> I am concluding that Opera's use of beta/preview versions is really
>> only suitable for people who don't rely on the mail/newsgroup/newsfeed
>> portion of the client. If you rely on those functions, I think Opera
>> is far too buggy in these interim releases to be counted upon.
>
> The whole point of beta-testing is to find the bugs before the final
> product is released. If you want reliable mail/newsgroup/newsfeed then I
> would humbly suggest that beta-testing is not for you.
And may I humbly suggest that this is not a *beta* question.
The concept of M2/Opera Mail is great, but its implementation has been
flawed from the start. Although I love the browser, I can't recommend its
mail function. For clients whose mail traffic is important, I usually
point in other directions than Opera. It has big problems: error prone,
lack of sufficient tools to validate and work with the mail data, lack of
functionality (IMAP, anyone?), etc. For smaller operations that use mail
*only*, it seems to fit the bill, though. But be ready to do some
undocumented maintenance work after a while.
Although I hate the way M2 works now, I still can't switch to other
clients: I'm hooked (if you can read Norwegian: look at my sig!). I've
tried other clients - I always return to Opera. The concept of M2 is
brilliant. But it has cost me a lot in terms of lost hours due to missing
messages and corrupted mailboxes.
Regards,
Y J Landro
--
Bruker Opera sin revolusjonerande e-postklient: http://www.opera.com/m2/
|
|
| | From: | Trevor and Michelle Gough | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:18:01 -0600 |
|
|
|
"Y J Landro" wrote in message
news:opskvkmyrxod9r59@latitude...
> Bob Williams skreiv Wed, 19 Jan 2005 15:57:02 +0000
>
>> In message , Trevor
>> Gough writes
>>> I am concluding that Opera's use of beta/preview versions is really
>>> only suitable for people who don't rely on the mail/newsgroup/newsfeed
>>> portion of the client. If you rely on those functions, I think Opera
>>> is far too buggy in these interim releases to be counted upon.
>>
>> The whole point of beta-testing is to find the bugs before the final
>> product is released. If you want reliable mail/newsgroup/newsfeed then I
>> would humbly suggest that beta-testing is not for you.
>
> And may I humbly suggest that this is not a *beta* question.
>
> The concept of M2/Opera Mail is great, but its implementation has been
> flawed from the start. Although I love the browser, I can't recommend its
> mail function. For clients whose mail traffic is important, I usually
> point in other directions than Opera. It has big problems: error prone,
> lack of sufficient tools to validate and work with the mail data, lack of
> functionality (IMAP, anyone?), etc. For smaller operations that use mail
> *only*, it seems to fit the bill, though. But be ready to do some
> undocumented maintenance work after a while.
>
> Although I hate the way M2 works now, I still can't switch to other
> clients: I'm hooked (if you can read Norwegian: look at my sig!). I've
> tried other clients - I always return to Opera. The concept of M2 is
> brilliant. But it has cost me a lot in terms of lost hours due to missing
> messages and corrupted mailboxes.
>
> Regards,
> Y J Landro
> --
> Bruker Opera sin revolusjonerande e-postklient: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Ditto!
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| | From: | Geoff Morris | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Thu, 20 Jan 2005 20:07:20 +0100 |
|
|
| On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:18:01 -0600, Trevor and Michelle Gough
wrote:
>> Although I hate the way M2 works now, I still can't switch to other
>> clients: I'm hooked (if you can read Norwegian: look at my sig!). I've
>> tried other clients - I always return to Opera. The concept of M2 is
>> brilliant. But it has cost me a lot in terms of lost hours due to
>> missing
>> messages and corrupted mailboxes.
>
> Ditto!
If you go through the old articles here and in mail+news, you'll find many
threads on this subject - and I have participated in most of them.
Luckily, I've found deleting the lexicon directory (and in one or two very
desperate cases, the index too) helps with mail, and deleting and
re-creating RSS seems to sort out the recent "RSS turns up wherever the
hell it wants to" bug that has occasionally popped up.
(This hasn't happened on my XP box at home at all, for what it's worth,
only my old 98 machine and on NT4 at work.)
Unfortunately, these bugs and other oft complained about missing features
such as much better sorting / importing of *SENT* mails (and I still don't
understand why there's no standard "sent-and-received" view) have been
here from day 1... this is what creates the kind of feeling you see in
this thread.
I don't want to be rude, but since the first beta (which was a long time
ago now!) nothing seems to have really changed in M2 apart from the
re-worked storage/indexing, the learning filter and the addition of feeds!
--
Geoff
Sorry about the munged address - too many viruses out there!
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| | From: | Joe Bloggs | | Subject: | Re: M2 | | Date: | Thu, 20 Jan 2005 22:51:49 +0000 |
|
|
| On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 15:57:02 +0000, Bob Williams
wrote:
>In message , Trevor
>Gough writes
>>I am concluding that Opera's use of beta/preview versions is really
>>only suitable for people who don't rely on the mail/newsgroup/newsfeed
>>portion of the client. If you rely on those functions, I think Opera
>>is far too buggy in these interim releases to be counted upon.
>
>The whole point of beta-testing is to find the bugs before the final
>product is released. If you want reliable mail/newsgroup/newsfeed then I
>would humbly suggest that beta-testing is not for you.
My experience with M2 is almost identical to the original poster's,
but I'm using an allegedly non-beta release (7.54).
I love Opera as a browser and wouldn't switch to any other. But it
seems to me that the developers care more for constantly adding new
features, and even more to tinkering with the user interface, than to
producing a stable product that actually works as advertised.
The cause of independent browsers in general, and of Opera Software in
pafrticular, is harmed rather than helped by the mindless defence of
its many faults by true believers.
I generally like beta testing, and have done so for quite a few
programs over many years. But I - and many others - resent being used
as an involunatry beta tester when using so-called release versions.
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