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 | | From: | Blaeden | | Subject: | Here they go again.... | | Date: | Sat, 18 Dec 2004 08:35:50 -0500 |
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 | http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Law/2004/12/17/787664-cp.html
That insurance they cancelled in 02 may not look like such an expence after
all once this is settled. Lets hope for the sake of the kids (in Scouting
at least) that it isn't the case.
December 17, 2004
Scouting official faces charges
By JOHN COTTER
EDMONTON (CP) - Police investigating a Scouts Canada official on charges of
possessing child graphy say there's no evidence the pictures involved
young members of the Scouts.
Frank Jannis Kense, 52, was charged Thursday with accessing and possessing
child graphy after ually explicit pictures were found on computer
CDs.
"Officers have been able to identify hundreds of images believed to be of
males and females under the age of 18 engaged in various poses and engaged
in various ually explicit acts," Edmonton police spokesman Andy Weiler
said Friday.
"We have nothing to indicate at this point that there was any link at all
with any of the organizations he was involved with."
Kense has been suspended from his position as executive director of the
Scouts' Alberta Northern Lights Council pending the outcome of the court
proceedings, said Rob Stewart, executive commissioner and CEO of Scouts
Canada.
"As an organization, we are very disturbed by these charges," Stewart said
in a release from Ottawa.
"We have confidence in the justice system and rely upon it to ensure that
appropriate action is taken."
Police began investigating in August after receiving a complaint about
ually explicit photos of children on a computer.
The computer was later seized and a search warrant was obtained for a home,
where police found CDs of child .
Scouts Canada officials in Edmonton who were phoned at home were shocked by
the charges, some hanging up when asked to comment.
Others referred calls to Scouts Canada's national office in Ottawa, where
officials also declined to be interviewed.
The Scouts Canada headquarters in Edmonton, which was supposed to be open
Friday from 9 a.m. to 5 p.m., was closed. A hand-written note taped to the
door said it would remain closed for the next few days. No reason for the
unscheduled closure was given.
Kense was also hired last summer as the Alberta Liberal Party's interim
executive director. His contract expired Friday.
Liberal Party spokeswoman Keiran Leblanc said the charges had nothing to do
with the expiration of Kense's contract.
"We were saddened and concerned when we heard the news about Mr. Kense,"
said Leblanc.
"Mr. Kense is entitled to due process and we hope he will be treated
fairly."
Scouts Canada said it has a stringent screening program for employees and
volunteers, including interviews and police checks. Subsequent checks are
conducted every three years.
In 2002 the organization cancelled part of the insurance that protected it
again ual abuse claims because of soaring insurance rates.
This is the latest such case involving Scouts to make headlines.
Last May, a nurse at Toronto's Hospital for Sick Children, who was also a
Scouts Canada volunteer, was charged with possessing child graphy.
Police raided a home after a tip from a co-worker and seized a laptop
computer and computer discs that contained hundreds of images of children.
Scott Faichnie was fired from the hospital after he was charged with two
counts of possession of child graphy, one count each of accessing child
graphy and making child graphy available.
When he was hired, all of his references checked out, the hospital said.
In Nova Scotia last year, child graphy charges against a former Scout
leader were dropped when evidence in the case was ruled inadmissible because
of police search tactics.
Trevor Scott Harvey of Lower Sackville, N.S., was charged in June 2002 after
a computer, several diskettes and some CDs were seized.
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| | From: | Karl Pollak | | Subject: | Re: Here they go again.... | | Date: | Sat, 18 Dec 2004 19:49:56 GMT |
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"Blaeden" wrote:
>http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Law/2004/12/17/787664-cp.html
>
>That insurance they cancelled in 02 may not look like such an expence after
>all once this is settled. Lets hope for the sake of the kids (in Scouting
>at least) that it isn't the case.
>"We have nothing to indicate at this point that there was any link at all
>with any of the organizations he was involved with."
While I rarely miss an opportunity to piss all over the Baseline Road
Bullies, I think -- scratch that -- I KNOW that you are completely off the
mark on this one.
Further, I think it would be highly irresponsible to raise parents' fears
in the Edmonton area by trying to suggest that their kids are or have been
at any time in any sort of danger.
As an Exec. Director, this guy had no access to Scouting kids. There is no
evidence at all to link him or his pictures to any Scouting members, not
even to the idea that he manufactured those pictures. The only evidence is
that he had the pictures.
>Scouts Canada officials in Edmonton who were phoned at home were shocked by
>the charges, some hanging up when asked to comment.
Like duuuh, what the hell is there to comment on? "Gee what a surprise,
who wood have thunk, he seemed like such a nice fellow, I am so shocked
...blahg blah blah.." The point here is that you have a business
relationshihp with the guy, you may like him, or not, but you know
absolutely nothing about what he does when he goes home. Nor should you
know. So if he keeps African parrots or collects worthless postage stamps
with pictures of dead people on them, that would probably be a great
surprise to you as well.
Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men ....?
Only The Shadow knows ...
>Others referred calls to Scouts Canada's national office in Ottawa, where
>officials also declined to be interviewed.
That is the correct procedure. SC pays good money to Jennifer Austin to
handle media inquiries, she's the designated spokeswoman for the
organization, so others should kindly shut up, because in all likelihood,
they can only make matters worse for Scouts Canada's image, by running off
at the mouth.
>Kense was also hired last summer as the Alberta Liberal Party's interim
>executive director. His contract expired Friday.
Now here is something I would like to find out about:
Why is Scouts Canada paying a guy who is working for another employer,
never mind for a political party at pre-election time, a very busy time for
the office staff??
If he's working full bore for the party, how much time is he spending
working for Scouts Canada?
>Last May, a nurse at Toronto's Hospital for Sick Children, who was also a
>Scouts Canada volunteer, was charged with possessing child graphy.
Again, there is no evidence that Faichnie did anything illegal to kids
either at Scouts Canada kids or the hospital. He did take pictures of kids
at the hospital but there was nothing objectionable on those pix, other
than he took them without permission.
>When he was hired, all of his references checked out, the hospital said.
Which only means that he had not been caught before. Not much of a
comfort.
--
Scouting is a game. Go play outside!
K. Pollak, Richmond, BC
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| | From: | Micheal Artindale | | Subject: | Re: Here they go again.... | | Date: | Fri, 17 Dec 2004 18:03:28 -0500 |
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> Which only means that he had not been caught before. Not much of a
> comfort.
Which is the main reason that PRC dont work. If someone has not got caught
yet for a crime, how will you be protecting anyone? On the flip side, You
can get a pardon for a crime, then become a leader.
I know 2 things about me.
1 -- my PRC is clean, and i have not gotten a pardon for anything.
2 -- Ecept for minor Traffic offences, I have not broken any laws, nor will
I.
I am guessing this is true for most leaders, wish I could say all...
Micheal
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| | From: | Blaeden | | Subject: | Re: Here they go again.... | | Date: | Sat, 18 Dec 2004 19:38:32 -0500 |
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| Yer right Micheal. No system or check is fool proof. While they do weed
out a few people who have had problems in the past (and probibily a few good
people who have made foolish mistakes when they were younger) I think all it
serves to do is to give the lawyers and insurance people a leg to stand on
when someone does get caught. They can then say "See, we took all
reasonable steps to make sure we brought in a good person. You can't hold
us (SC or the insurance company) liable for what they do after that."
"Micheal Artindale" wrote in message
news:HH2xd.34722$%p1.2242866@news20.bellglobal.com...
>
>> Which only means that he had not been caught before. Not much of a
>> comfort.
>
> Which is the main reason that PRC dont work. If someone has not got caught
> yet for a crime, how will you be protecting anyone? On the flip side, You
> can get a pardon for a crime, then become a leader.
>
> I know 2 things about me.
>
> 1 -- my PRC is clean, and i have not gotten a pardon for anything.
>
> 2 -- Ecept for minor Traffic offences, I have not broken any laws, nor
> will
> I.
>
> I am guessing this is true for most leaders, wish I could say all...
>
> Micheal
>
>
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| | From: | Karl Pollak | | Subject: | Re: Here they go again.... | | Date: | Sun, 19 Dec 2004 20:18:50 GMT |
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"Blaeden" wrote:
>... I think all it
>serves to do is to give the lawyers and insurance people a leg to stand on
>when someone does get caught. They can then say "See, we took all
>reasonable steps to make sure we brought in a good person. You can't hold
>us (SC or the insurance company) liable for what they do after that."
That's a nice theory, but it does not work in practice.
Yes, for the purposes of public image, for reassurance of parents, the
entire vetting process is a good thing.
As to apportioning blame in court, it does not do a thing. A court would
look at the incidents specifically and make a ruling whether in that
particular instance SC did what was necessary.
As for the insurance company, well as you have noted in your opening post,
there ain't none. SC is self-un-insured for child abuse.
--
Scouting is a game. Go play outside!
K. Pollak, Richmond, BC
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| | From: | Karl Pollak | | Subject: | Re: Here they go again.... | | Date: | Sun, 19 Dec 2004 05:50:41 GMT |
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"Micheal Artindale" wrote:
>> Which only means that he had not been caught before. Not much of a
>> comfort.
>
>Which is the main reason that PRC dont work.
They were never intended to catch anyone before they would comit a crime.
But they do help weed out repeaters. A swim club in my town happened to
flush out a guy who tried to sign up as a volunteer. He was living here
under false name and was wanted all over the USA. Fortunately, the pres of
the swim club happened to be a cop who arranged for a discrete departure of
the darling, straight into the arms of US authorities, without any silly
delays like extradition.
>If someone has not got caught
>yet for a crime, how will you be protecting anyone?
Well, one of the methods is the "2 deep policy" which you continuously
break and which can eventually leave you open to false allegations.
Also, it is extremely rare that any abuse would occur during a Scouting
event. The usual MO is for the abuser to gain the kids' confidence and
affection, then meet with them outside any Scouting connection, like his
home.
>On the flip side, You
>can get a pardon for a crime, then become a leader.
No Michael, once you have been convicted for any crime aginst children or
of any ual nature, no matter how many pardons you get, that particular
convictin will continue to be reported if the requestor is a children's org
or the position you are applying for would put you anywhere near contact
with your previosu victim type of people.
Initially, there was a hole in the system with the pardons, but after
people like Beaver leader Durham in Kitchener walked through it, the
parliament acted and closed it.
>I am guessing this is true for most leaders, wish I could say all...
You can say that about all, because SC have booted out even people who had
20 year old "criminal spitting on sidewalk" convictions on their record,
despite the fact that since then they lead exemplary lives and had already
been qualified and very respected leaders in SC for years.
--
Scouting is a game. Go play outside!
K. Pollak, Richmond, BC
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