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 | | From: | dangdangdoodle | | Subject: | Why root religion out of politics | | Date: | Sun, 23 Jan 2005 09:20:23 -0800 |
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If one religion is allowed to stay in politics, then the door is open
for all religions to get into politics. Then there will be NO peace.
So even if it is your religion, you should work to get it out of
politics.
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| | From: | stormwatcher | | Subject: | Re: Why root religion out of politics | | Date: | 24 Jan 2005 01:36:40 -0800 |
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| Who said democracy is peaceful? Rarely was and rarely will be.
And there is no reason to get religion out of politics. Those who
advocate this are usually attempting to silence the democratic voice of
religious people.
Whether you are a pagan, a Green, a Xtian or an atheist, you have input
into politics.
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| | From: | Julian D. | | Subject: | Re: Why root religion out of politics | | Date: | Sun, 23 Jan 2005 15:21:09 -0500 |
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| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 09:20:23 -0800, dangdangdoodle
wrote:
>
>If one religion is allowed to stay in politics, then the door is open
>for all religions to get into politics. Then there will be NO peace.
>
>So even if it is your religion, you should work to get it out of
>politics.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2005/01/20/sen_clinton_urges_use_of_faith_based_initiatives?mode=PF
Sen. Clinton urges use of faith-based initiatives
By Michael Jonas, Globe Correspondent | January 20, 2005
On the eve of the presidential inauguration, US Senator Hillary Rodham
Clinton last night embraced an issue some pundits say helped seal a
second term for George W. Bush: acceptance of the role of faith in
addressing social ills.
In a speech at a fund-raising dinner for a Boston-based organization
that promotes faith-based solutions to social problems, Clinton said
there has been a "false division" between faith-based approaches to
social problems and respect for the separation of church of state.
"There is no contradiction between support for faith-based initiatives
and upholding our constitutional principles," said Clinton, a New York
Democrat who often is mentioned as a possible presidential candidate
in 2008.
Addressing a crowd of more than 500, including many religious leaders,
at Boston's Fairmont Copley Plaza, Clinton invoked God more than half
a dozen times, at one point declaring, "I've always been a praying
person."
She said there must be room for religious people to "live out their
faith in the public square."
The issue of faith in politics has been at the center of debate
following the presidential election, with some arguing that Bush's
strong identification with religious values was a key to his victory
over Senator John F. Kerry.
The dinner was a fund-raiser for the National TenPoint Leadership
Foundation and the Dorchester-based Ella J. Baker House. Both youth
outreach programs are directed by the Rev. Eugene F. Rivers 3d, a
leader of the clergy-based efforts to stem youth violence in Boston in
the 1990s that has become a national model for community-police
partnerships.
The minister has often criticized established black leaders and
liberal politicians, saying they have failed to deal honestly with the
problems of youth violence.
Rivers said he hoped Clinton's appearance last night would build
broader support for an issue on which some Democrats have been
skittish.
"She is in a position to articulate a progressive vision around this
issue of faith and values," Rivers said.
"The Clintons, on faith-based solutions, have always been way ahead of
the curve," said Rivers, citing President Clinton's support of a 1996
law banning the federal government from discriminating against
religious organizations seeking funding available to groups delivering
social services.
In her speech, Clinton praised the efforts of Rivers and others
working to curb youth violence, saying those of faith are often most
willing to walk the streets of the country's most dangerous
neighborhoods to try to reach young people. Where others "see
trouble," she said, Rivers and faith-based soldiers "see God's work
right in front of them."
Although the senator has insisted that she is focused only on her work
in the Senate and constituents in New York (she faces reelection in
2006), talk of another Clinton seeking the White House seems to be a
topic of speculation wherever she goes.
Mayor Thomas M. Menino got the ball rolling with his introduction of
Clinton last night, calling her "the first first lady to be a US
senator and maybe the first woman to be something else."
"I don't know who the right person will be in 2008, but Hillary is
certainly one of the most compelling political figures on the
horizon," said Alan Solomont, the former finance chairman of the
Democratic National Committee, who attended last night's event. '
Clinton wasn't the only would-be candidate generating buzz at the
dinner. Seated prominently at the head table was Deval Patrick, a
former assistant attorney general in the Clinton administration who
said last week that he is considering a run for Massachusetts governor
in 2006.
"I'm interested and I'm exploring," said Patrick last night. "I'm
trying to cast a wide net and talk to a lot of people."
The 48-year-old black attorney from Milton said he will decide in the
next several months whether to seek the Democratic nomination for the
state's highest office. Patrick, who was in charge of the Justice
Department's civil rights division from 1994 to 1997, left his
position last month as chief legal counsel to Coca-Cola Co., where he
worked for nearly four years.The event was billed as the Ella J. Baker
Awards Dinner, and four leaders were honored for supporting the youth
outreach efforts of the Baker House.
Receiving awards were Boston Police Commissioner Kathleen M. O'Toole;
Sylvia R. Johnson, associate director of the Hyams Foundation; former
US attorney Donald K. Stern; and Roxbury District Court Judge Edward
R. Redd.
JD
"On the other hand, I think sometimes I take kind of a delight
in who the critics are."
-President George W. Bush
Time's Person Of The Year
2004
"The course of this nation does not depend on the decisions of
others."
-President George W. Bush
SOA
2003
"Exit polls do not support the allegations of fraud due to rigging of
voting equipment. Our analysis of the difference between the vote
count and the exit poll at each polling location in our sample has
found no systematic differences for precincts using touch screen and
optical scan voting equipment," the report found.
-CNN
http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/01/19/exit.polls/
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| | From: | Roedy Green | | Subject: | Re: Why root religion out of politics | | Date: | Mon, 24 Jan 2005 02:12:56 GMT |
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| On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 09:20:23 -0800, dangdangdoodle
wrote or quoted :
>If one religion is allowed to stay in politics, then the door is open
>for all religions to get into politics. Then there will be NO peace.
>
>So even if it is your religion, you should work to get it out of
>politics.
Obviously religion motives people's political beliefs. That is normal
and proper. The problem comes when one group starts trying to use
LEGISLATION to proselytise its particular religion. That is where I
say you must put your foot down. All preaching must be done by the
group itself. It has no right to piggyback on the power of the state.
The USA has already made some grave errors in that regard:
1. faith based initiatives: the Moonies and Falwellians get tax money
to increase their power and corruption. They further become toadies of
the current administration to keep the flow going. It corrupts both
ways.
2. forcing the use of the word "god" in official oaths. It forces
atheists to perjure themselves right off the bat.
3. giving tax breaks to churches. Very similar atheist groups like
the Humanist Association get no such break. Why should an atheist be
forced to subsidise the spread of televangelist lunacy? If churches
get breaks it should be on the same grounds other groups do, e.g. for
their charitable acts only.
Bush has kiddie anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
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| | From: | Julian D. | | Subject: | Re: Why root religion out of politics | | Date: | Sun, 23 Jan 2005 22:13:46 -0500 |
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| On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 02:12:56 GMT, Roedy Green
wrote:
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 09:20:23 -0800, dangdangdoodle
> wrote or quoted :
>
>>If one religion is allowed to stay in politics, then the door is open
>>for all religions to get into politics. Then there will be NO peace.
>>
>>So even if it is your religion, you should work to get it out of
>>politics.
>
>Obviously religion motives people's political beliefs. That is normal
>and proper. The problem comes when one group starts trying to use
>LEGISLATION to proselytise its particular religion. That is where I
>say you must put your foot down. All preaching must be done by the
>group itself. It has no right to piggyback on the power of the state.
>
>The USA has already made some grave errors in that regard:
>
>1. faith based initiatives: the Moonies and Falwellians
Hillary Clinton is a 'moonie' or a Falwellian?
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2005/01/20/sen_clinton_urges_use_of_faith_based_initiatives?mode=PF
Sen. Clinton urges use of faith-based initiatives
By Michael Jonas, Globe Correspondent | January 20, 2005
>get tax money
>to increase their power and corruption. They further become toadies of
>the current administration to keep the flow going. It corrupts both
>ways.
>
>2. forcing the use of the word "god" in official oaths. It forces
>atheists to perjure themselves right off the bat.
>
>3. giving tax breaks to churches. Very similar atheist groups like
>the Humanist Association get no such break. Why should an atheist be
>forced to subsidise the spread of televangelist lunacy? If churches
>get breaks it should be on the same grounds other groups do, e.g. for
>their charitable acts only.
>
>
>Bush has kiddie anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
>http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm
JD
"On the other hand, I think sometimes I take kind of a delight
in who the critics are."
-President George W. Bush
Time's Person Of The Year
2004
"The course of this nation does not depend on the decisions of
others."
-President George W. Bush
SOA
2003
"Exit polls do not support the allegations of fraud due to rigging of
voting equipment. Our analysis of the difference between the vote
count and the exit poll at each polling location in our sample has
found no systematic differences for precincts using touch screen and
optical scan voting equipment," the report found.
-CNN
http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/01/19/exit.polls/
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| | From: | Bill Gamelson | | Subject: | Re: Why root religion out of politics | | Date: | Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:50 -0600 |
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| >>So even if it is your religion, you should work
>>to get it out of politics.
I think we should begin by getting politics out of our public schools.
--
"Truth lags last, limping along on the arm of Time."
-- Baltasar Gracian
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